All posts by bibleprotector

We have gone beyond 1769

With an array of issues in 1769, like “Beer-sheba, Sheba” in Joshua 19:2, or missing out on part of a verse in Revelation 18:22, we are grateful we have a better edition that gets everything right, known as the Pure Cambridge Edition.

We don’t use a 1769. No one does. Well, unless you’d use these ones. But you shouldn’t, you should use the Pure Cambridge Edition.

Here are two examples of a 1769 Folio:

https://archive.org/details/kjv-1769-oxford-edition-full-bible/mode/2up

https://archive.org/details/kjv-1769-1772-blayney-folio/mode/2up

King James Bible believers need come to another level of academia

I have seen the need among KJBO to come to another level of academia. There are also dangers with that, because modernist infidelity is everywhere.

With Oxford now making the Bodleian 1602 MS available, we see Tim Berg and his friends now looking at it. I must give a shout out to Bryan Ross and Christopher Yetzer, who are among the few who have been looking at this matter.

At the same time that Tim Berg has been talking about the Bod 1602 MS, Steven Anderson arbitrarily said that the KJB had a persistent typographical error. This has directly led to Mark Ward discussing the Bod 1602 MS, and is leading back to this point: Do we rely on almost 400 years of editing in the KJB as we have it, or are we going to turn back to the Bod 1602 MS, like modernist editor David Norton?

I believe in the Providence of God, that the editing of the KJB, the detection and eliminating of typographical errors is complete, and that we do not need to turn back to any old annotated document to change anything in the KJB as it now stands.

The words, spelling, the punctuation are now fixed, and we don’t need and will not allow any new alterations or corruptions under the guise of “editorial revision”, “discoveries” or so-called “modern scholarship”.

KJBOs say that the influence of academia has been a problem for Bible-believing churches. We recognise that we must reason spiritually and Biblically, not merely on subjective history, rationalism and empiricism, etc.

So a KJBO would ask me to explain why do we need to go to another level of academia? (What’s the assumption here? It is that academia = worldly error.)

It’s a good question, I am only too happy to answer it. When I got involved with KJB discussions online back in 2007 (and having read everything I could from the internet on the subject to that time), I knew there wasn’t the academic rigour from Ruckman, Waite or Riplinger, etc. like what was needed. They made good points, but they all had issues.

KJBO had a lot of holler but not so much book learning (although there were some names like Hills, Holland and Vance). I knew that the movement had to go to a higher level, because anti-KJBO were able to run rings around KJBOs. In fact, most anti-KJBOs today, like J. Burris, T. Berg, M. Ward, etc. are all former KJBOs. But because KJBO believed things like kinda double inspiration, “Antioch stream” and that both “he” and “she” were both correct in 1611 in Ruth 3:15, and other such ideas, once they were shown the errors of those things, they would naturally reject all KJBO. (There are other factors too, around IFB versus Reformed, but that’s another issue.)

When I first tried to find answers around why there were word differences in present King James Bible editions, there was very little info. People were fighting about textual criticism and translation methods, but were not so much knowing about the history of the KJB itself. I read Scrivener, I corresponded with David Norton and read “secular” histories.

When Rick Norris would make some accusation about some word that had been edited in the KJB, I found there were very few that could deal with him, like Steven Avery, Will Kinney, Brandon Staggs, etc. But in the main, Norris, like a fore-runner to Mark Ward, was really quite effective in putting doubts in people’s minds about the KJB.

So what do I mean academic? I mean the fact that it was the KJB men who were the crowning glory of the educational institutions in their day. I mean that it was our people who edited the KJB like Joseph Mede. By academic I don’t mean merely using citations and quoting people in context, and that latter point is a given.

I am advocating for the high heritage. It is very easy to think that the modern scholars and secular studies now rule, but they are both and all usurpers from us. I say just because it appears the enemy dominates the academic field like a flood, we should not reject true scholarship.

Matthew 13:52 Then said he unto them, Therefore every scribe which is instructed unto the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which bringeth forth out of his treasure things new and old.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLfPWY1WEx4

Anderson, Ward and the truth

I received an email stating that King James Bible supporter Steven Anderson, who has a rather bad reputation in the USA, has come out and said that the KJB has an error in it.

“And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree:” (Deut. 21:22).

Apparently his going to the Hebrew has led him to reject the words “to be”. (As if the KJB men didn’t translate properly or typographical mistake persisted in the KJB for over 400 years!)

The great enemy of the King James Bible’s perfection, Mark Ward, has come out with a video, explaining why he thinks Steven Anderson is wrong, and why the words in the KJB are right.

We don’t need Mark Ward “helping” people when much of the time he is hindering people.

So, let’s get this straight from a believing perspective:

Most importantly, the entire history of the KJB that has “he be to be”, so it is not a recent edition which has made a change, or some printing error which has arisen. It is not an edition issue, but something which belongs in the entire history of the KJB.

Often people go to the Hebrew, go to the Geneva and the Bishops’ and consult Webster’s dictionary, Gill’s and other commentaries, etc. But that is not our method here.

Let’s look at the plain language, grammar and logical progression in the passage itself.

It is obvious in Deuteronomy here, that the judicial process is where someone is found and declared to be put to death, and that that’s clearly what the KJB is saying.

Here is the sequence:
1. A man does the deed,
2. He is found guilty and sentenced (i.e. he be to be executed), and
3. He is hanged

And all of that takes place in the past tense, because the actual context is about the body now hanging on a tree, that it doesn’t remain strung up, because that’s the actual point of the passage, which is in verse 23. The passage is written from the perspective of what happened leading to the body being hung.

So then, talking about the present corpse, in the past tense:

1. the “man have committed a sin worthy of death”

2. the judging process declares that “he be to be put to death”

3. and then the executioner “hang him on a tree” …

“His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;) that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.” (Deut. 21:23).

Which of course explains this:

“Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:” (Galatians 3:13).

The English is plain and clear, Steven Anderson would be wrong to think there is anything wrong in the KJB, it is not a typo. It is, in fact, good and proper grammar.

As for Mark Ward, one must wonder at his real motives, is it to rejoice at Steven Anderson’s error? Is it yet another opportunity for him to make some backhanded comments about those who allegedly make mistakes with the KJB’s perfect grammar and vocabulary?

With Mark Ward not having the KJB as his final authority, there’s every chance he will contort to accept that Steven Anderson’s opening the door to change the KJB is possible and legitimate.

UPDATE:

You can find the usage “he be to be” used out there, for example, in old books here: https://archive.org/search?query=%22he+be+to+be%22&sin=TXT

Mark Ward’s video is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vphp-bJn9GE&t

SECOND UPDATE:

Steven Anderson answered Mark Ward’s video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPcWH20v648

Which has led to Mark Ward retracting part of what he said and altering his opinion in a new video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2GC18_o5zs

There is a whole side issue being discussed as well, which is about whether a person is dead before the corpse is hung. From a New Testament perspective, we know actually that Jesus died while being hung on cross, however it seems usual that in the Old Testament people were stoned before being hung. But to make some sort of theology that Deuteronomy 21:22 was saying people cannot be killed by hanging because of “the Hebrew” is nonsense.

Amminadib

An examination of the Pure Cambridge Edition of the King James Bible on the specific issue of the word Amminadib in Song of Solomon 6:12, by Matthew Verschuur.

INTRODUCTION

Along with the case of the spelling of “Geba” at Ezra 2:26 in the Pure Cambridge Edition against most other editions, is the issue of the word “Amminadib” in Song of Solomon (Canticles) 6:12, for its obscurity and minuteness.

If we can argue that the Pure Cambridge Edition is right in every other place, then we can argue that it is right in this one also.

Again, if we can argue that Providence has supplied the Pure Cambridge Bible as it is (as presented on the Bible Protector website, bibleprotector.com, no less), then we should trust that God has got the truth to us.

And again, the same Holy Ghost who inspired, the same Holy Ghost who preserved is the same Holy Ghost who is at hand today witnessing and attesting, showing and revealing, yea, interpreting and bringing to heart the knowledge of the certainty that even in this very precise particular, the very letters and marks in the Pure Cambridge Edition of the King James Bible, as we have it in full verity, is correct.

THE PLACE ITSELF

We now step forward, to the passage itself:

12 Or ever I was aware, my soul made me like the chariots of Amminadib.

(Song of Solomon 6:12).

This book is part of the poetic interrelation between the lover and the beloved, which is both the story of Solomon and the Shulamite, and also is said to be a picture of Christ and the Church.

In the narrative, the lover goes to the where the nuts and fruits grow, and then describes the feeling of his soul, saying his soul was like the chariots of Amminadib. We can understand the driving force of chariots, the powerful feeling of them.

The commentators, pre-1611 translations and the margin offers us meanings. There are primarily two, the first is that there was a person called Amminadib who was renowned for driving chariots, the second is that the chariots were of a class or category of being princely/noble or willing. Those who dive into the words and their meanings say that there are two Hebrew words, being “Ammi” (my people) and “nadib” (willing).

There is no problem to suggest that the word Amminadib might mean “my willing people”, but that cannot be derived from Scripture so easily.

Instead, we have to ask the more pertinent question as to why this word is presented to us as a Hebraic-cum-English proper noun, a name, and not “translated”, as is done in many other Bible translations.

From this we can conclude that the translators themselves, and the Holy Ghost, intended for us to know that this is a proper name, and that the pertinent information is not in what the rabbis say “Amminadib” means, but what our English teachers, Providence and the Spirit says/shows it to mean.

Very clearly, the chariots are not just chariots, they are qualified into some special class, they are not just chariots, they are Amminadib chariots, and what class that is, we can understand from the context, must be the best sorts, an elite or special class.

The next verse speaks of armies, so we know the chariots are not some jerry-rigged rickshaw contraptions.

THE GRAMMATICAL SITUATION

The word Amminadib, we are told, is made up of two components from Hebrew. We also have another word, which is very similar, which is found multiple times in the Bible, which is Amminadab and Aminadab.

If we use the 1611 King James Bible line brakes as a guide, where the word is hyphenated in such cases, we observe the brake on Ammi-, in Song of Solomon 6:12, and with Amminabab at 1 Chronicles 15:10.

Now, while in 1 Chron. 15:10 we see “Ammi-“, we see the whole word in the next verse.

The issue is that in Bibles, lets say some examples from the late 19th century, the word “Ammi-dabib” is made a compound name thus, but Amminabab is not presented in its places as a compound name.

In the Pure Cambridge Edition we can find those copies which have “Ammi-dabib” and those which do not have a compound, being “Amminadib”.

There are four examples. The first are some early PCEs, which have “Ammi-dabib”. The second are the pronouncing editions, which have “Amminadib”. The third are the clear editions, which have all the pronouncing words listed in the front, and then have the text at that place read “Amminadib”, and the fourth are Collins editions, which are all pronouncing as well, with “Amminadib”.

PRONUNCIATION

While it is listed in commentaries, etc., that the word components are “Ammi-“ and “Nadib”, and we find the pronunciation markings, and that in theological circles, the pronunciation consistently is the same as the Redpath markings in the Collins and Cambridge Bibles, which is like “Ammin’adib” not “Ammi’nadib”.

Even though the first 1611 Edition broke both “Amminadab” and “Amminadib” when at the end of the line at “Ammi”, that is not how it is pronounced by any known source.

THE QUESTION

Some Pure Cambridge Editions have “Ammi-nadib” compounded, and others (primarily pronouncing editions) do not compound the word. Examples of non-pronouncing editions with no hyphen or compound dash exist. There are other contemporary editions to the PCE, like the Cambridge Concord and the London Edition, which also do not compound the word at that place.

The standard representation, which is a critical and precisely correct representation, of the Pure Cambridge Edition is the text files supplied by Bible Protector on the bibleprotector.com website, which does not hyphenate or compound the word “Amminadib” at Song of Solomon 6:12.

Remembering that this a minor variation that exists within the Pure Cambridge Edition printed tradition, it is not a situation where such a Bible is “invalidated”, but indeed such printed editions are used Bible Protector’s chief man Matthew Verschuur and at the church he attends. However, the official, proper text is that on the website, and many of the ordinary every day printed PCE KJBs in use from Collins, Cambridge, Holman and Church Bible Publishers all do not compound, hyphenate or break the word after “Ammi”.

A CHRONOLOGICAL EXAMINATION

The Geneva, and more importantly, Bishops’ translation, which was used as a basis for making the King James Bible, did not have the word “Amminadib” at all, but had translated it various ways, much like the margin of the KJB has it.

In 1611, we find the word at the end of a line, so on that basis we cannot assert whether it is a compound name hyphen at all, and if examining the close word “Amminadab”, one could easily infer no compounding, it was just treated as one word.

In November 2023, when this is written, numerous scans of early KJB editions became available online, which were not available for previous examinations on this topic. Here we find at Song of Sol. 6:12:

Barker (London) 1612 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1613 “Amminadib” blackletter (end of line break)

Barker (London) 1617 “Amminadib” (no break)

Norton and Bill (London) 1618 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1618 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1619 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1621 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1622 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1626 “Amminadib” smaller size (no break)

Barker (London) 1626 “Amminadib” larger size (no break)

Norton and Bill (London) 1628 “Amminadib” (no break)

Bill, Hills and Newcombe (London) 1628 “Amminadib” very different setup with clear roman typeface (end of line break)

Missing front page 1929 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker and Bill (London) 1630 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1631 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1631 “Amminadib” different size (no break)

Barker (London) 1631 “Amminadib” another one (no break)

Missing front page 1631 “Amminadib” (no break)

Thomas and John Buck (Cambridge) 1631 “Ammi-nadib” blackletter (has the break)

Barker (London) 1634 “Amminadib” (no break)

Barker (London) 1634 “Ammi-nadib” blackletter (has the break)

Source: https://archive.org/search?query=holy+bible&page=2&and%5B%5D=year%3A%5B1607+TO+1639%5D

As the Cambridge edition of 1637, and the edit of 1638, had “Ammi-nadib”, we can conjecture that the first Cambridge edition of 1628 and the edit of 1629 pioneered this pattern.

We can conclude on the basis of the 1612, etc., that the end of line break of “Ammi-“ in the blackletter editions was never intended to be a compound name, but that was introduced probably in 1629, as it was certainly there in the Cambridge of 1631 and 37 which are online, and 1638 as is stored in the State Library of Victoria.

Thus we may safely and certainly say that the 1611 Editions and the 1613 Edition would be for the non-compounding of the name.

The name was compounded from the Cambridge Edition of 1629 and that of 1638, through to the 1769 Edition. We now leap forward to the late 19th century, where most editions were compounding the name, as the were directly influenced by the 1769, and yet we find that the PCEs from Cambridge and Collins, which had H. A. Redpath’s pronunciation scheme, did not hyphenate or compound. Neither did the London Edition of the 1950s, nor the Cambridge Concord Edition.

What is interesting is that while early editions would break the word at the end of a line at “Ammi”, there is an Oxford edition, probably from the 1950s, which breaks “Amminadab” at Numbers 10:14 at the end of a column “Ammin-adab”, which is similar to the word in question, which is compounded in that Oxford edition, as “Ammi-nadib”.

CONCLUSION

We can therefore conclude that if an editor was forced to choose the safest course, that he should not hyphenate at all, but have “Amminadib”, and that the evidence is in line with the PCE having no hyphen or dash there.

The fact that some editions of the PCE do have a hyphen there is not a reason to doubt the Bible Protector work, but on the contrary, the Bible Protector work is indicating what is plainly printed in 1612 and other Barker editions, which in turn indicate that the end of line hyphen in 1611 and 1613 was just that, and not a compound word.

The pure word is pure, and it is right, correct and precise to the very jot and tittle.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

(Matthew 5:18).

Scanned Pure Cambridge Edition available online

Here’s an example of a Pure Cambridge Edition King James Bible online:

https://archive.org/details/holybiblecontain0000unse_z7h7/mode/2up (with the Apocrypha, no italics though.)

Just out of interest, here’s a 1637 Cambridge Edition online:

https://archive.org/details/16371638TheKingJamesBibleCambridgeDarlowAndMouleNumber402/mode/2up

These are both fully, freely downloadable. The second link is only for nerds, scholars and book magpies, the first is the one I want to talk about.

While the correct PCE text is available on my website, to have a historical copies laid out by professional printers is a valuable resource.

There are also some examples of historically printed plain text PCEs, here’s one:

https://archive.org/details/holybiblecontain0000unse_v9q2/mode/2up (Login, no download.)

There are doubtless more, and in time, there will be more.

Also, there are PCEs to buy online, both new (from Holman publishers from and Church Bible Publishers) as well as vintage copies… I’ve just picked up a number of great copies including the huge one photographed below through ebay!

A quarto lectern Bible, pica typeface, with references.

Finally, a bonus, you can obtain scans of an original 1611 printing here.

The “middle roaders”

WHO ARE THE MIDDLE ROADERS?

There are plenty of Evangelicals (and Pentecostals in particular) who are genuine born again people, who believe a lot of good things well, but have need to know things more perfectly. This reminds me of Apollos, “And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.” (Acts 18:26).

The “middle of the road” Evangelicals/Pentecostals are the kinds who don’t compromise the Gospel on one side (e.g. reduce Church worship to entertainment or doubt the literalness of Bible narratives), but don’t go far enough with their views to align with “perfection” on the other.

These are the well meaning Evangelicals/Pentecostals who shouldn’t be disparaged for being “lukewarm”. Why? Because there is a great chance these people can hear the Spirit of God, and do as Smith Wigglesworth did, and “come out” of their current condition. He said, “Unless Pentecost wakes up to shake herself free from all worldly things and comes into a place of the divine-likeness with God, we will hear the voice of God, ‘Come out’ and He will have something far better than this. I ask every one of you, will you hear the voice of God and come out? You ask, ‘What do you mean?’ Every one of you knows without exception, there is no word for Pentecost, only being on fire. If you are not on fire, you are not in the place of regeneration. It is only the fire of God that burns up the entanglements of the world.”

One of the views of these “middling” Evangelicals/Pentecostals is that people shouldn’t get caught up in side issues. Now I agree there is a problem where some people go way off the track on unimportant issues, and get into dangerous extremes of doctrine.

The middling types console themselves that they are not “off the track”, “in the weeds”, because they are in the middle, but being in the middle can still be a dangerous place, because it can lead to compromise and the eventual slide out of orthodoxy and truth.

Being sensible is good, but those with a middling attitude are in danger of being fence sitters. There are black and white doctrinal positions where believers must take a polar position.

There is a big opportunity for all of us to assess and discern where we are at. Jesus said, “Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.” (Revelation 3:20).

BIBLE VERSION/TRANSLATION ISSUE

Recently, an Australian Pentecostal ministry effectively said that people shouldn’t get hung up on side issues (they would say using the King James Bible alone is one of these issues), yet at the same time put out a teaching on their website that made it very clear that modern versions/translations are good, and the King James Bible is not so good. In fact, the particular Pentecostal theologian who wrote the article spent over half the time talking down the King James Bible.

I’d like to respond to that, not with a point by point refutation of their many alleged criticisms of the King James Bible, but on an appeal to the work of the Spirit.

The background to this issue is really about the rise of Infidelity. Infidelity is the spiritual condition of being not only unfaithful to God, but of rejecting God. Infidelity was popularised and promoted in the Enlightenment which led to the French Revolution. However, the creeping work of Infidelity was afterward seen slowly coming in through science, education and the churches of the English-speaking world. It is now marching though Evangelical Christianity.

Old time Pentecostals were among those most against Infidelity, but sadly, Infidelity has been creeping into Pentecostalism too.

Politically speaking there is a view called modern conservatism. This is the same attitude as is seen with the middling Pentecostals. It is often likened to being “less progressive” and “having your foot on the brakes while heading towards the political left (or, worldliness)”.

The problem then is in time middling Pentecostalism while arrive to the same position that the fake modern entertainment so-called Pentecostals now inhabit. But possibly, the middling Pentecostal could actually go the other way, and come to stand for all the right doctrines, including the use of the King James Bible.

SOME REASONS IN FAVOUR OF THE KING JAMES BIBLE

When I was very young, the King James Bible was the main Bible used in Australian Pentecostalism. However, cracks had begun to appear. Pastors would turn to a paraphrase, or talk about what the Greek “really” means, and by time of the late 1980s, the KJB was largely replaced in Australian Pentecostalism.

Older people still had their KJBs, and some American preachers still used it, and some even used it when Rodney Howard-Browne rolled through in the mid-1990s.

The old time Pentecostals, including the fathers of Richmond Temple in Melbourne, all used the King James Bible, so why sell this birthright for a mess of pottage? Why abandon good meat for dainties?

When middling Pentecostals complain that tongues and gifts are vanishing out of Pentecostal churches, and bemoan the rise of smoke machine Sunday clubs, shouldn’t they have the same desire for the old Bible?

There is a danger in the seductive message about getting in on the “new thing” that “God” is apparently doing, where people abandon what was good in the old ways.

Tradition, doctrine and holiness are not bad, in fact, they are works of the Holy Ghost. Pentecostals have too often attacked “tradition” as being “religious”, when there is clearly and evidently good traditions and true religion.

“If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man’s religion is vain.” (James 1:26).

“Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.” (2 Thessalonians 2:15).

CLAIM THE LAODICEAN PROMISES!

Jesus pointed to three areas that were problems with the Laodiceans. We can also take a spiritual interpretation of the same passage as applying to the Church today, and on these three areas, the middling Evangelicals/Pentecostals must take heed.

17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

(Revelation 3:17-19).

The first problem is that the middling Evangelicals/Pentecostals can claim spiritual richness, like “we have a superabundance of scholarship, we have many modern versions and translations”. Yet, Jesus says we ought to obtain the real richness, which is His pure word.

His pure word is available today, it is the King James Bible!

The second problem is that middling Evangelicals/Pentecostals have issues with upholding holiness standards. The Evangelicals often disparage themselves as “sinners saved by grace”, and the Pentecostals often talk about not judging people and how God is apparently wavering his standards. That type of view is a reaction against uncharitable legalists and old fashioned rigidity. They say that people got caught up in holiness standards in the past (about fashion and cultural behaviour) that they got their eyes off Jesus. But now the opposite is the problem, they have their eyes on all these perceived slights of alleged “Pharisees” and “condemners” that they are not looking so intently at Jesus at all. Preaching sermons against “being religious” and making a religion out of “I’m in a relationship” is probably a worse condition than the alleged problems of Charles L. Greenwood “women ought to wear hats” culture, and has become anti-legalism legalism. Free grace is not licence.

The old Holiness of Wesley, Finney, Wigglesworth and Greenwood is still here today, it is an integral part of Faith Pentecostalism!

The third problem is that middling Evangelicals/Pentecostals are being blinded by what they think is good hermeneutics and exegesis. They are in danger of not understanding doctrine properly because when they look to the Scripture, there is a filter on that says, “know the Greek”, “bow to Jewish culture” and “follow Gordon Fee’s methods”. But the haze of error and the fog of the devil can roll in.

When Jesus said to hear what the Spirit is saying to the churches, He meant we can hear clearly without all these interventions and contrivances when we interpretate Scripture. And we can perceive clearly today!

14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:

15 For this people’s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

(Matthew 13:14–16).

SOME MORE IN FAVOUR OF THE KING JAMES BIBLE

Middle type Pentecostals are not bad Christians, they are not false brethren or heretics. They certainly have good doctrines, they use the Scripture in their teaching and they believe it to be the inspired, infallible Word of God.

But on the Bible version/translation issue, too many are ignorant or misled.

When they say that textual variants in the old manuscripts don’t matter, it is strange, because there are a lot of important Pentecostal doctrines in the end of Mark, and for a long time many Pentecostals knew modernism was attacking them by minimising those verses.

The charge that King James Bible words have changed meaning since 1611 is wrong, in that the old meanings of words still exist and are still known. We are able to educate people on the meaning of doctrinal words, why is it suddenly bad that people have to be aided in knowing some King James Bible words? Also, we actually believe that the Holy Ghost is helping people to understand the Bible, since when should we act like He is not at work, and are therefore obliged to lay aside our King James Bibles?

Since the Holy Ghost has been at work through history and present since the day of Pentecost, we should believe that by the Church practice and by divine providence, proper copies of the Scripture have passed down to us, and that the translation was able to be made right in 1611, and that God has prepared the English language to be capable to spread His exact words and meanings to a global audience for the latter days. God is good, awesome and able to bring about perfection, right?

I have to shake my head if some Pentecostal theologian says that “the KJB has been revised three times” and that “there is not just one version of it”. As a Pentecostal, and having done a lot of study on this, I can confirm that the KJB has in fact gone through many different editions. Yet in all that, no one could honestly say that the 1611’s underlying text and translation has been changed in the KJB. Yes, there’s been errors of the press and corrections of them and yes spelling and grammar has been standardised, but no the King James Bible today is not a different “version”.

I note the irony that the middling Pentecostals and in full agreement with the McArthurite anti-Pentecostalists on the Bible version/translation issue.

Evangelicals and Pentecostals will be doing well if they turn towards the King James Bible, and stop this strange drive of producing unedifying materials against the KJB (blogs, videos, etc.)

Mark Ward attacks English

Mark Ward seems to have turned his attention somewhat to both the idea of translating the Bible into every dialect, and yet in arguing that, is also venomously arguing that English is not special, there is no perfect English translation, etc.

I am sure God has a lot to do with English. Interestingly, for someone who claims usage determines meaning, there is a blindness to English usage for the Gospel determines or indicates God’s providence.

That God both made and designed all languages, yet somehow God has not designed English in any special way any more than any other, does that make sense? The same God who designs is the one who can use one above another. The clay cannot backchat the potter.

Providentially, we see both the wide use of English and that we have such a good Bible, the King James Version. How much better it is that we have English as a means of reaching more people everywhere, and how much benefit is it for this to occur, both naturally (i.e. for commerce) and spiritually (allowing others access to the best Bible in the world)? English has been used of God, and that the KJB is perfect, are not statements based on arrogance, but providence and, more importantly, Bible doctrine. Yes, there are verses and passages which point to these concepts. (I know full well that the modernistic methods of hermeneutics will of course seek to dissuade of this truth.)

And yes, while it has been laudable to bring translations and Bible teaching to the various nations and tribes in the past, it is true that the best Bible and the BEST THEOLOGY exists in English. So the nations of today into the future are being served better by this. God does choose instruments. You know very well that Jacob was preferred over Esau. So likewise the Jacobian Bible over the pride and so called “wisdom” of Edom.

Just because God used Hebrew, Syriack and Greek once upon a time does not mean or require continuous favour with those languages or manuscripts. No Scripture teaches that, and Providence itself shows the opposite. The Reformation was in fact all about translation, not retention of Latin or Greek, for then would not the Gospel preaching have been accompanied by teaching Greek and Latin etc. to the masses? But now those former things are left behind, they have waxed old and are ready to vanish away. What was before in multiple languages of Hebrew and Greek is now in one, English. The twain are made one, better than what we had before. The God who is able to speak any language (Acts 2) is also the God who has one message to be made known to the nations, and, as it says in Zephaniah 3:9, turn them to A pure language. Again, while Isaiah 28:11 is taken (as by Paul) to speak of the speaking in other tongues, it is also shown that the same passage says ANOTHER tongue, meaning one language. Ironically, the Pentecostal movement today both has arisen and perpetuates from one language group, being the English-speakers.

Also seeing that the languages of Hebrew, Syriack and Greek (and those places in the Gospel where it is clearly Hebrew not alleged “Aramaic”) are not spoken today, how more obvious is it to have God’s words in a living, present and powerful language: English?

Mark Ward admits, “You have to encounter God’s Word in translation.” And there is one key, blessed language: Biblical English. (This is not to say that other translations are evil, no, the God of grace has allowed imperfect translations, and that which has been helpful for the various non-English speakers of the world is not to be anathemised though the progress towards the universality of one English Bible as a final standard is coming to pass.)

To argue that other language groups have “claims on our conscience” is a perverted doctrine. Yes, the Gospel should go to nations, but that should not be a reason to disparage or wear a black arm band about English. That’s what woke people do, they apologise for English, they try to “revive” neo-Hebrew, Welsh or Australian Aboriginal constructs in line with an antichristian anti-English view. So to call God’s plan of the excellence of the Bible and the spreading of the Gospel in English as “arrogance” or “chauvinism” is surely misguided. As if to prove the common foundation of Infidelity behind wokery and this attack on English, we have Mark Ward suggesting something that sounds suspiciously like open borders and promoting illegal immigrants. This indicative leftwing ideology is antithetical to what is found in the proper interpretation of Scripture.

We note the reality of foreigners learning English, and the education of people who interact with Biblical English (the KJB), yet Mark Ward, driven by something (?!) admits that such views make him angry! All families/nations of the Earth are to be blessed, and Christ Jesus coming to the nations today is going to be a unitary Gospel which has, under God, its highest expression in the English-speaking peoples. This is evident both historically with missionary endeavours in recent centuries, but is also evident as far as what is the Holy Ghost destiny evident (or “manifest”) among us. Mark Ward’s call to arms to try to topple the supremacy of English is an attempt to attack the power of the truth in English in its world reaching power.

Timothy Berg answered

Recently, Timothy Berg and Mark Ward made a video, and Timothy put a post up on his Facebook page about it.

I commented as follows:

There are multiple statements and implications from both The Translators to the Reader and the Epistle Dedicatory which point to the idea that the KJB makers thought their work was right, good and perfect. (Not made by special inspiration, but due to providence.)
Sadly, Mark Ward likes to engage in word games which includes trying to make out as if words written in 1611 do not mean what they mean.
Also, since Mark Ward has an agenda of undermining the correctness and reliability of the KJB, his motivation would be to ensure that the KJB men are not to be read as saying what they said, but perversely saying what Mark Ward wishes them to say (i.e. the opposite).
“Remember the advice of Nazianzene, It is a grievous thing (or dangerous) to neglect a great fair, and to seek to make markets afterward”.

Then Timothy Berg made a number of claims in two lengthy posts, beginning with this, I quote him here in italic typeface: I would love to see these “multiple statements and implications” that point to the idea that the KJB Translators “thought their work was … perfect.”

To which I made two replies (and I’ve corrected a few typos I made on Facebook):

The KJB makers state, “For by this means it cometh to pass, that whatsoever is sound already, … the same will shine as gold more brightly, being rubbed and polished; also, if any thing be halting, or superfluous, or not so agreeable to the original, the same may be corrected, and the truth set in place.”
Their translation was to keep that which was good from other translations, and to improve upon them, even making the analogy of gold being bright, rubbed and polished, hence, a picture of supremacy above all others at least, if not perfection.
And, again, they did not speak in the relativist terms of modernists, but spoke of having the truth set in place, in other words, full accuracy, and that surely is perfection of translation.
They write, “that out of the Original Sacred Tongues, together with comparing of the labours, both in our own, and other foreign Languages, of many worthy men who went before us, there should be one more exact Translation of the holy Scriptures into the English Tongue”.
Now however you read, if one “more exact translation”, or “one more” “exact translation”, the meaning of the former means it was supreme to others, the latter means one more translation only, which is the exact translation. In either case, the word “exact” speaks of perfection, and if the KJB is “more exact” or else the “exact”, that is surely higher than and certainly counter to the view of modernists.
They also state, “And now at last, by the mercy of God, and the continuance of our labours, it being brought unto such a conclusion, as that we have great hopes that the Church of England shall reap good fruit thereby”.
From this we can see they did not expect to fail but rather see the increase, and that the conclusion being both the KJB and the fruits it would produce, is treated in a proto-millenarian light.
They write, “So that if, on the one side, we shall be traduced by Popish Persons at home or abroad, who therefore will malign us, because we are poor instruments to make God’s holy Truth to be yet more and more known unto the people, whom they desire still to keep in ignorance and darkness”.
Clearly, they disagreed with the Romanists, but the accusation is telling, for though apparently poor instruments, the outworking was to make God’s truth more and more known, meaning the level of increase and of alignment to accuracy, and supremacy, is obvious.
They also state, “Yet for all that, as nothing is begun and perfected at the same time, and the latter thoughts are thought to be the wiser: so, if we building upon their foundation that went before us, and being holpen by their labours, do endeavour to make that better which they left so good; no man, we are sure, hath cause to mislike us; they, we persuade ourselves, if they were alive, would thank us.”
Notice here the reference to finishing the work of translation holistically. If Tyndale began, the KJB men finished. They use the word perfected, meaning that they thought it, well, perfect.
If the Bishops’ or Geneva was good, theirs was better, and better means superior. The KJB surmounted all. Since it perfected the former translations, it now cannot be improved upon.
Sometimes, those who have set themselves against the KJB like to quote this part: “Therefore as St Augustine saith, that variety of translations is profitable for the finding out of the sense of the Scriptures: so diversity of signification and sense in the margin, where the text is not so clear, must needs do good; yea, is necessary, as we are persuaded.”
This is not to be read to doubt the KJB maker’s work, but shows the principle that the KJB men themselves following, in consulting the Fathers, other translations, etc., to decided upon their work, and then, to set the variation in the margin so that the reader could check their work.
The KJB men spoke of “finding out of the sense”, which is really the opposite of the modernist approach. The modernist wants there to be multiplicity and only statistical certainty rather than singularity and absolute certainty. But the KJB men presented their work as the sense found out, so to speak, and as the clarification of doubtful places. (They didn’t hide these, they placed the variant translations in the margin.)
The translators conclude, “O receive not so great things in vain: O despise not so great salvation.”
A good, exact and perfect translation is indeed a great thing. To have the word of God properly in English is a great salvation indeed.
And, “It is a grievous thing (or dangerous) to neglect a great fair, and to seek to make markets afterwards”.
That is, upon having opportunity to partake of that which is actually providentially ordained of God, some foolishly have rejected the KJB’s rightness and perfection, seeking now to obtain after the day of visitation. Thus, the KJB men spoke prophetically of what the modernists have done, in that they say that all translations are but imperfect and having neglected the KJB, are now floundering in the famine of modernism and its idol of imperfection onlyism.

And the second post immediately following:

The modernist arguments against the KJB’s rightness, goodness, exactness and perfection are refutable.

  1. It is argued by modernists that because the originals were viewed as perfect, a translation could not be perfect.
    However, the KJB men consistently treat the word translated as representing the very Word.
    Decades afterwards, the Westminster Puritans stated, “But because these original tongues are not known to all the people of God who have right unto, and interest in the Scriptures, and are commanded, in the fear of God, to read and search them, therefore they are to be translated into the vulgar language of every nation unto which they come, that the Word of God dwelling plentifully in all, they may worship him in an acceptable manner, and, through patience and comfort of the Scriptures, may have hope.”
    Thus, the view was that the translation represented the Scripture, for it was clearly the translation used in worship, etc., and the translation was called “Scriptures”.
    Seeing that the Puritans of the 1650s only officially printed the KJB, that is again providential evidence of what translation was accepted as representing, i.e. really being, Scripture.
  2. It is argued that the fact of “errors of translation” existing in former Protestant translations somehow negates any translation is, or that any translation could be, perfect. (And since Romanists said that the Vulgate was a perfect translation, surely their being wrong must make that any claim for a Protestant is wrong also.)
    I have in the previous post quoted the KJB men arguing that their work corrected former errors of translation.
    The view that essentially no translation can be perfect is a modernist maxim based on Enlightenment philosophy.
    And the Catholics were wrong to claim both textual and translational accuracy for the Vulgate, for they claimed inspiration for it, but the KJB men’s argument for the goodness, rightness, exactness, perfection and supremacy (to other translations) of their translation is based on a providentialist argument (or really providentialist matrix of arguments, in brief, that God is at work in history, that they are by their works bringing about improvement and that they believe that the good hand of the Lord was upon them, etc).
    The KJB men state, “we have at the length, through the good hand of the Lord upon us, brought the work to that pass that you see.”
    (Thus, the reason why the Koran and the Vulgate are not perfect is because the KJB is. Whereas a modernist, formulating upon Enlightenment ideas, will say, “Translations of necessity have errors [so therefore all claims for] Textual Absolutism [and translational absolutism is and] was mistaken.”)
  3. That the KJB men identified “spots” in former translations is not a tacit admission of their expecting “spots” in their own work. They simply do not imply this is the case in any way any where in their Preface or Epistle.
    Instead, our interlocutor labours the point that Hebrew and Greek are being the sources of English translation, this being a point no one denies.
    The providentialist view is that even though Protestants can be found here and there to say that they think that Hebrew and Greek are masters to the English, the result has been that the KJB has become the sole heir. This is something which all the manifestations of Providence reveal.
    Whether some translator felt anything in the moment of doing his work is irrelevant. That he believed something, that grain of a seed that translating under King James a good thing, this has flourished to a tree which has far outgrown, indeed caused the entire supersuccession of, the former Hebrew and Greek masters.

Answers to questions about the King James Bible

1. Is the KJB the original Bible?

No, but it is the final one.

2. Why do they call it the King James Bible?

Because it was authorised by King James I and printed in 1611 under his authority.

3. Is the King James Bible accurate? Is the KJB good?

Yes, the King James Bible is based on the historical Hebrew, Greek and Latin texts. It is based on the majority of Greek texts which representative copies were collated and printed in the 16th century in what is called the Textus Receptus. The King James Bible builds on some other Protestant versions, and is considered the final text.

Yes, the King James Bible is a highly accurate translation that exactly presents the original languages in English.

Unlike modern versions and translations made as influenced by Enlightenment-based assumptions, the KJB has been well accepted by many Christians for many years.

4. What religion is the KJB?

Christian and Protestant.

5. Is the KJB Catholic? Is the KJV used by Catholics?

The KJB is not Catholic but can and is used by Catholics.

6. Why did King James change the Bible?

King James revised former translations to get an exactly correct Bible. He didn’t actually do it, but he ordered scholars and church leaders to do it. It was printed in 1611, and went on to displace all other Bibles in use.

7. What books did King James remove from the Bible?

None. The Apocrypha isn’t commonly printed, but that is not considered canonical Scripture.

8. Who made the KJB?

A large number of scholars and church leaders under King James.

9. Is the KJB inspired? Is the KJB perfect?

The King James Bible was not made by special inspiration, but because of it being at the right place and at the right time, people were able to make a good translation. Always a few people try to say there are mistakes here or there, but they say this largely because of the influence of Enlightenment-based reasoning. In fact the KJB is perfect, exact and precise. The King James Bible translators themselves indicated that they thought their work was right.

10. Why is the KJB so popular?

Mainly because it has been used by lots of Protestants for a long time, and it has been considered the standard, and is commonly used by committed Christians.